Jack McVicar Interview: Union Electrician

Jack McVicar Interview

Recorded August 26, 1964

Transcribed by Donna Sacuta, December 2025

 

Interviewer [00:00:00] The 26th of August 1964, and you’re Mr. Jack McVicar, M-C-V-I-C A-R, right? Well, the first thing I got here is finding out exactly where you lived during various times, for instance. When did you come to BC?

 

Jack McVicar [00:00:30] I came to Vancouver in 1910.

 

Interviewer [00:00:35] 1910? Where did you come from?

 

Jack McVicar [00:00:36] I came from Glasgow, Scotland.

 

Interviewer [00:00:41] Did you come directly to Vancouver?

 

Jack McVicar [00:00:43] Come directly, yes.

 

Interviewer [00:00:47] I see, and what did you, have you lived in Vancouver since then?

 

Jack McVicar [00:00:50] All the time, with the exception of being up at Stave Falls for a period of say three years or so.

 

Interviewer [00:00:57] When was that?

 

Jack McVicar [00:00:58] Well, that would be 1921, to say 1924.

 

Interviewer [00:01:14] Were you in Europe during the war, the First World War? Or did you stay in Vancouver?

 

Jack McVicar [00:01:19] I was in Vancouver, yeah.

 

Interviewer [00:01:22] Well, now, when you came to Vancouver, where did you start working?

 

Jack McVicar [00:01:30] Oh I worked in different places in Vancouver. The first job that I ever had in Vancouver was with a biscuit factory. And from then on I went into the electrical end of it. I worked for the Hinton Electric, electrical construction company. Different small outfits, EMF Electric. And I’ve been connected with the electrical business ever since.

 

Interviewer [00:02:00] So when did you join the union then?

 

Jack McVicar [00:02:02] I joined the union in 1915.

 

Interviewer [00:02:05] 1915, and this is the IBEW (International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers)?

 

Jack McVicar [00:02:08] The IBEW.

 

Interviewer [00:02:11] Which local was that? Had they merged?

 

Jack McVicar [00:02:13] 213.

 

Interviewer [00:02:14] 213? Okay and you’ve been a member ever since?

 

Jack McVicar [00:02:22] Ever since, yes. I’m pensioned now, of course.

 

Interviewer [00:02:29] Did you ever join any of the other unions, like say the OBU (One Big Union) or?

 

Jack McVicar [00:02:37] No.

 

Interviewer [00:02:39] I don’t think there’s any others. IWW (Industrial Workers of the World) was never —

 

Jack McVicar [00:02:42] No.

 

Interviewer [00:02:43] You didn’t join them. Well, could you give me an idea of the executive positions you held, if any, in the union?

 

Jack McVicar [00:02:55] No, I held no executive positions, just on the Sick Committee work.

 

Interviewer [00:02:59] You were on the Sick Committee, I see. And from when to when?

 

Jack McVicar [00:03:03] Oh, just for one year, I suppose it would be in probably 1919, 1920 something like that.

 

Interviewer [00:03:18] What about conventions?

 

Jack McVicar [00:03:20] I haven’t been to any convention.

 

Interviewer [00:03:32] Not the labour council either?

 

Jack McVicar [00:03:33] No.

 

Interviewer [00:03:33]  What about political conventions?

 

Jack McVicar [00:03:37] No.

 

Interviewer [00:03:37] We’re trying to see if there’s any, in what industry, this may not apply to your industry, it might. We’re trying to see if there’s any changes in the way you worked over the years. That is technological change that was significant, or the system of pay, how about employment agencies and so on. You see what I mean? The way people worked. Was there much automation or this kind of thing?

 

Jack McVicar [00:04:14] Well, there’s a certain amount of automation, but in certain branches of the electrical business you can’t consider automation to come into it all together, I mean that is the men that are actually working at it, they have to work with their hands and do their wiring and all that kind of thing which isn’t done by automation. That involves the individual.

 

Interviewer [00:04:39] So there’s been no significant changes there that affected you.

 

Jack McVicar [00:04:41] Not in that, excepting for testing, there are lots of good testing equipment that has a bigger chance of shooting the trouble in a quicker way. As I say, it’s more direct whereby some of the instruments that your person has to test with than going it the old-fashioned way.

 

Interviewer [00:05:09] Does this have any effect on the way you worked? On the way your work? Didn’t really affect you that much personally?

 

Jack McVicar [00:05:18] No, it didn’t affect me at all, as a matter of fact.

 

Interviewer [00:05:22] Or other members of the union?

 

Jack McVicar [00:05:25] In fact, I believe with the new methods, it was more or less helpful to us. It made our work a little bit less hard. You can put it that way. Thank you.

 

Interviewer [00:05:47] Thank you. What about your—you were always paid on an hourly basis?

 

Jack McVicar [00:05:59] Well, when I was operating, we were paid by the month. I operated at different plants. We were paid the month and when I came into the electrical job, of course, we were paid by the day. There are lots of monthly employees, of course, in the electrical field too.

 

Interviewer [00:06:21] And was this directly by the employer, or was it a contract, or piece rate? Were you directly paid by your employer?

 

Jack McVicar [00:06:33] By the employer, yes.

 

Interviewer [00:06:33] And how about employment agencies? How about in your industry? How did you go about getting a job?

 

Jack McVicar [00:06:44] Well, I never had anything to do with an employment agency excepting, as I say, when I was very young I hired out from an employment agency. At that time, of course, there were lots of employment agencies in Vancouver and jobs would be put up on the board and you would apply for this job or that job and you paid according to what the wages were per day for the job.

 

Interviewer [00:07:13] And was this controlled by employers?

 

Jack McVicar [00:07:17] No, it was composed by private individuals. And I think it did come under a certain amount of government restriction.

 

Interviewer [00:07:30] Were you ever blacklisted at all?

 

Jack McVicar [00:07:32] Not that I know of. (laughs) If I were, they never told me about it.

 

Interviewer [00:07:39] So you never had much trouble. When you came, of course, your union was already established.

 

Jack McVicar [00:07:47] Oh, yes, it was established here.

 

Interviewer [00:07:50] Well, I’m trying to find out, I’ve got a whole lot of political parties here, but I’ll show you a list of them, that existed in the early days before the CCF (Co-operative Commonwealth Federation), and I’m trying to find out— Could you give us an indication of whether you remember supporting these or even being a member of them or running for them.

 

Jack McVicar [00:08:23] No, I’ve never been a member of any of these parties. At no time.

 

Interviewer [00:08:30] You don’t remember supporting them at all?

 

Jack McVicar [00:08:30] No. Other than I may have voted sometimes Liberal, and sometimes I might have voted Conservative, depending who the man was. Or I might’ve voted straight labour, depending on the man.

 

Interviewer [00:08:51] There were various labour parties, so we’ll get around to some of them. Now, what about the Oriental campaigns? Do you remember any of them, the anti-Asiatic business?

 

Jack McVicar [00:09:14] No, I don’t really remember them at all. Previous to me coming to Vancouver, I think they’d had some trouble around 1909. Probably around in that area, 1908 or 1909.

 

Interviewer [00:09:29] Well, it seems to me there was still a lot of it going on for the first decade after the First World War.

 

Jack McVicar [00:09:38] Well, I never had any experience with that, so I can’t speak intelligently of it.

 

Interviewer [00:09:43] I see. Do you remember what your union local, what your members felt about it?

 

Jack McVicar [00:09:52] No, I can’t speak of the members in that respect. You mean from a competitive point of view?

 

Interviewer [00:09:57] No. Well, what was the feeling in the local, what did they feel about Chinese and Asiatic labour and what did they think about, did they support the Anti-Asiatic League?

 

Jack McVicar [00:10:18] I don’t think there was any, I never heard any great discussion about that. They were no threat, these people, to the electrical industry. I’ll put it that way. Some of the unions may have had some difficulty, but not in ours. I don’t think that was ever a threat at any time.

 

Interviewer [00:10:38] You say that some of the other unions might have felt threatened by it. What do you think were the reasons for the threat?

 

Jack McVicar [00:10:49] Well, I suppose the main reason was that probably these people were working for cheaper money per day. That’s the only reason, but we have that same condition here existing today in 1964. We have very much of that here, but in this city. We have people that have come out here from Europe that are working for very low wages compared with union wages.

 

Interviewer [00:11:31] What do you think now the unions right now take the same position anymore? Why do they feel they’ve changed their position?

 

Jack McVicar [00:11:43] In regard to what?

 

Interviewer [00:11:45] To the Asiatic labour business. For instance you don’t have an Asiatic Exclusion League.

 

Jack McVicar [00:11:51] I never committed myself to say that we had changed in any way in our local, because as I said before, there were no threats.

 

Interviewer [00:11:59] The other unions certainly have, some of the other unions were anti-Asiatic. The Vancouver Labor Council was.

 

Jack McVicar [00:12:11] That is a thing that I can’t really speak intelligently of at all.

 

Interviewer [00:12:15] You don’t have any real opinions on it.

 

Jack McVicar [00:12:16] The only unions that would have any effect, and that would be where probably was a threat was in the fishermen’s union or something like that, where they had different Europeans coming in here and cutting into their daily life.

 

Interviewer [00:12:39] Now, one about socialism, do you remember getting in contact early with the socialists, socialism?

 

Jack McVicar [00:12:54] Oh yes I remember socialism was very very strong at one time. I always considered it quite strong. I mean it was done quite openly and there was a lot of meetings held in different buildings here in Vancouver, Sunday nights particularly. And I think a lot of people used to go to them because there had no other place to go. There was no entertainment here on Sundays, other than going to church. Everybody didn’t want to go to church, and we had a lot of men in Vancouver that were living in the rooming houses, and they probably attended a lot these meetings that were held on Sundays. They may have gained a lot experience through it, too.

 

Interviewer [00:13:42] Do you remember who were the leading socialists in the early days here?

 

Jack McVicar [00:13:49] Well, you had, yes, you have fellows like Jack Harrington, and a lot of these names have escaped me now, but I just at this moment can’t remember. Pritchard, he was very strong. No, I can’t right off hand remember the names. If I sat down for a little while, I could probably remember more of them.

 

Interviewer [00:14:24] What about pamphlets and books and newspapers? I’m trying to find out if there were any books or newspapers that were particularly influential in converting people to socialism.

 

Jack McVicar [00:14:42] Yes, we had a paper here in Vancouver called Truth. It had quite an influence on the working people. I think it did quite a job. It came out with a lot of stuff there that was very good, probably some were very bad.

 

Interviewer [00:15:00] I see. And this is, you consider this as an influential—

 

Jack McVicar [00:15:05] That was one of the papers. I’m not condemning it at all because they had a lot of very interesting things in it.

 

Interviewer [00:15:11] What about books or pamphlets? Do you remember any?

 

Jack McVicar [00:15:15] Well, I have seen lots of socialist books and pamphlets but I can’t just put my finger and name them.

 

Interviewer [00:15:21] No outstanding ones?

 

Jack McVicar [00:15:26] No.

 

Interviewer [00:15:27] What about in your local? How did socialism fare?

 

Jack McVicar [00:15:35] It didn’t work at all in our local. Our local is a very, very, I consider a very conservative organization, and the thought of the members to my way of thinking ran along a conservative way. You would probably get the odd person that would be very socialistically inclined, but you couldn’t take that as the whole consensus of the local.

 

Interviewer [00:16:07] What do you feel, socialism is pretty well, in BC I think it’s stronger than anywhere else in Canada, or maybe North America. Do you have any ideas about why you think this is so wide in BC?

 

Jack McVicar [00:16:25] Well, my idea of it is that I think it’s due to a lot of people traveling to the coast here for climatic conditions, and there’s more of an intermingling of different types of people through that. Climatic conditions attract people to come here, particularly for winter work, to get away from the cold weather. And there’s an exchange of thought naturally takes place with the people that have been living in Vancouver for very many years with these people.

 

Interviewer [00:17:02] What about, do you remember any friction between early socialists and trade unionists?

 

Jack McVicar [00:17:13] Not outstanding, no, not outstanding.

 

Interviewer [00:17:17] Well, I get on to the next topic then, this woman’s suffrage, the movement to get women the vote. Do you remember any of that? Was your union involved in this at all?

 

Jack McVicar [00:17:30] No, no. Not to my knowledge. No, I never heard of that.

 

Interviewer [00:17:35] Wasn’t an important issue then?

 

Jack McVicar [00:17:37] Never became a very important issue. There were some women’s organizations here that were very strong, and I think they did a very good job in many cases.

 

Interviewer [00:17:48] Was it discussed at all in your local?

 

Jack McVicar [00:17:59] I never heard it discussed in the local.

 

Interviewer [00:18:00] Well, now, what about the First World War? Do you remember what your attitude was to the war?

 

Jack McVicar [00:18:09] Well, my attitude was that after the first recruiting office opened in Vancouver, I went in to join and I had two friends with me and they discussed this thing between each other and they advised me not to join at that particular time because I had my father and mothere here, were  getting on in years, and for me to stay and be with them because this thing wasn’t going to last very long. But it lasted four years.

 

Interviewer [00:18:48] So you were, you supported the idea.

 

Jack McVicar [00:18:53] Well I did to the extent of it might have been being young and being of an adventurous type it might’ve had something to do with it. We’ll put it that way.

 

Interviewer [00:19:04] What about your local now? What was their attitude?

 

Jack McVicar [00:19:07] Well we of course, as you may know, we had a lot of chaps out of our local went overseas and they seemed to respond very well.

 

Interviewer [00:19:19] What about conscription? Then the conscription issue came up, right?

 

Jack McVicar [00:19:26] Yes.

 

Interviewer [00:19:27] What is your attitude to conscription?

 

Jack McVicar [00:19:33] Well, of course, at that time, I don’t suppose I was giving that too much thought. And yet, on the other hand, I guess I was, because I was married then. I was taking maybe a little different path, but I didn’t want to go away and leave the family. I suppose that’s quite natural in a way.

 

Interviewer [00:19:56] And what about your local? Now, the reason I’m asking is, there’s quite a bit of organized opposition to conscription.

 

Jack McVicar [00:20:07] Yes, there was opposition all over the country to it, particularly in Quebec.

 

Interviewer [00:20:15] Also BC labour seems to be—

 

Jack McVicar [00:20:16] Yes, there was a definite argument about that.

 

Interviewer [00:20:23] Do you remember what your local’s attitude was?

 

Jack McVicar [00:20:25]  Not particularly, no. I don’t think I can remember that part of it, what the attitude was on that.

 

Interviewer [00:20:32] Well did you participate in any demonstrations?

 

Jack McVicar [00:20:37] None at any time.

 

Interviewer [00:20:41] Now, do you feel that, or how important would you say inflation and rising prices were on the union militancy?

 

Jack McVicar [00:20:58] Well, of course, as the prices were rising, naturally, your unions are for more money per day. That’s quite natural, and that applies not only to Local 213 but to all other locals. Unionism was required to get the standard of wages up higher. The standard at one time was very low. Your take-home pay wasn’t sufficient to raise a family properly. You just got the bare needs of life, I mean the replacement of clothes and different things for the children, and it was quite a problem. You don’t have very much over when you came home with your pay. In fact, it was very, very bad.

 

Interviewer [00:21:50] Well, do you feel that there was any repression by the government of union and political organization during the wars?

 

Jack McVicar [00:22:08] Well, nothing that I can say really outstanding about it, but of course, as I said before, labour had to try and get as much as they possibly could for to exist properly and to get a few luxuries that were really, should have been going to them. We’re living today at a different age where the take-home pay is so much more substantial that working men today have a better chance of providing for their families and a better way of life and also better homes to go into.

 

Interviewer [00:22:51] Well, did you after the First World War, what was your political affiliation?

 

Jack McVicar [00:23:22] Well, most of my political affiliation is voting straight labour, although I belong to no other labour organization other than my Local 213.

 

Interviewer [00:23:33] That means things like the Canadian Labor Party and the Federated Labor Party. Did your opinions change in any issues, were there any issues that made you change your point of view?

 

Jack McVicar [00:23:50] Not too much, I wouldn’t say too much. I try to size things up and vote for the man that I think is going to do the most for the working people today. If I vote today, I want to see that I’m voting for a man that’s going to something for labour. To make more of a proper living standard for everyone for that matter.

 

Interviewer [00:24:19] What about, you had no connections with the IWW (Industrial Workers of the World)?

 

Jack McVicar [00:24:22] None whatsoever.

 

Interviewer [00:24:22] Or the OBU (One Big Union)?

 

Jack McVicar [00:24:24] No.

 

Interviewer [00:24:31] Did your union, did you remember your local supporting these labur parties, the Federated Labor Party?

 

Jack McVicar [00:24:40] Oh, there may have been some support, but I can’t remember anything outstanding about that. It was a long time ago, but I suppose there was some support given to some of them.

 

Interviewer [00:24:53] What about the Workers’ Unity League?

 

Jack McVicar [00:24:56] Don’t remember them.

 

Interviewer [00:25:01] Okay.

 

Jack McVicar [00:25:02] Is this a joker?

 

Interviewer [00:25:03] No, no, it was a Communist federation of trade unions. What about the All-Canadian Congress of Labor? Came later on in the thirties.

 

Jack McVicar [00:25:22] Well, I think it’s been a pretty good thing.

 

Interviewer [00:25:26] I was trying to figure out whether your union was affiliated to it.

 

Jack McVicar [00:25:31] I think we were.

 

Interviewer [00:25:32] You think so?

 

Jack McVicar [00:25:33] I think we were, yes. I wouldn’t be positive about that. That’s been quite a while now.

 

Interviewer [00:25:48] What about the CCF? Did you, after CCF started, did you start supporting the CCF?

 

Jack McVicar [00:25:57] I supported some of the members, yes, that were starting, yes.

 

Interviewer [00:26:01] I see. And did you join?

 

Jack McVicar [00:26:04] Never joined, no.

 

Interviewer [00:26:10] Now, there’s the 1920s and the 1930s. During the Depression, did your income drop?

 

Jack McVicar [00:26:24] Not from the, there was no cut made, that I remember, any cut made in our wages. But we were put on there less time, during that time.

 

Interviewer [00:26:40] How? How much less time?

 

Jack McVicar [00:26:42] I think we were working four days a week. Some were working three, some three and a half, and that kind of thing.

 

Interviewer [00:26:52] And now, did this mean a drop in the standard of living to you?

 

Jack McVicar [00:26:58] Well, it meant that you had to be very much more careful. And I would say that affected your standard of living.

 

Interviewer [00:27:10] Did you have relatives at all that became unemployed that you have to support?

 

Jack McVicar [00:27:19] Well, no, I have no relatives that needed too much support. I had my father and mother I used to have to help a little bit. They were getting on in years. My wife’s parents weren’t doing too well during these times, and you try to do as much as you possibly can.

 

Interviewer [00:27:45] But this wasn’t really a serious commitment, was it?

 

Jack McVicar [00:27:48] No, no.

 

Interviewer [00:27:51] What about, do you feel that you were—did you during the time feel your were bad off yourself?

 

Jack McVicar [00:28:01] I wouldn’t say that I felt I was bad off. I mean, we were eating regularly, understand, but we couldn’t do things we’d like to do. That is, we couldn’t go for decent holidays, we’ll say.

 

Interviewer [00:28:15] Well, could you do that before the Depression?

 

Jack McVicar [00:28:18] Not very much, no. You were very much limited to that, too.

 

Interviewer [00:28:26] What about your union? Did it lose recognition at all, or did it stay on?

 

Jack McVicar [00:28:33] No, it was no losing recognition. I think it was always held in pretty high respect.

 

Interviewer [00:28:42] No, what I meant was that did they lose their bargaining power during the 30s or the 20s?

 

Jack McVicar [00:28:48] Yes, I think it would have quite an effect then, yes.

 

Interviewer [00:28:53] They were still in there.

 

Jack McVicar [00:28:55] That’s right, that’s right.

 

Interviewer [00:29:01] You know, we’re making good progress. What about the On-to-Ottawa Trek now? Are you involved in that? Do you remember this? The On-To-Ottawa Trek.

 

Jack McVicar [00:29:09] Don’t remember it.

 

[00:29:10] You don’t. Oh, this is a bunch of fellows went off to Ottawa to demonstrate about unemployment.

 

Jack McVicar [00:29:17] Oh, yes, yes. I remember something about that. Yes, now that you bring it to my attention, yes. I don’t think these things do too much good though.

 

Interviewer [00:29:26] So you weren’t involved in it?

 

Jack McVicar [00:29:27] I wasn’t involved, no.

 

Interviewer [00:29:28] How about your union?

 

Jack McVicar [00:29:30] I don’t think so There might have been some representation. I really wouldn’t know. I can’t remember that.

 

Interviewer [00:29:39] Do you feel that this was an actual labour activity, or do you feel this is outside the labour movement? This sort of thing, the On-To-Ottawa Trek.

 

Jack McVicar [00:29:53] It might have been influenced by some other organization, I wouldn’t say, definitely, because I don’t know. But it could have been due to oh, types of leadership that were governing things a little bit at the time, that they may have had an influence with the people to do that, thinking it was the right thing to do. It might have more influence with the government.

 

Interviewer [00:30:20] What about the unemployment organizations like the Central Committee of the Unemployed or the Relief Camp Workers, were you involved?

 

Jack McVicar [00:30:31] I wasn’t involved in that, no. But I don’t think they were getting very good results from what I’ve heard at these relief camps. That is to say they weren’t getting very much labour done for the amount of money they were paying up.

 

Interviewer [00:30:50] What about the union? Is it connected with this?

 

Jack McVicar [00:30:57] I don’t remember. I didn’t have anything to do with that.

 

Interviewer [00:30:58]  Do you remember the Post Office and the Art gallery demonstrations?

 

Jack McVicar [00:31:03] Oh yes, yes, I remember.

 

Interviewer [00:31:04] Were you involved?

 

Jack McVicar [00:31:06] I wasn’t involved in that. I remember it very well.

 

Interviewer [00:31:10] How about your union?

 

Jack McVicar [00:31:12] No, I don’t think we condoned all that kind of thing. I don’t think so. They were probably sympathetic with everyone that was in the thing, you know what I mean? I think everybody, with any feeling at all, was very sympathetic with the boys that had to do that kind of demonstrating. But we that were working, we were very fortunate.  I saw some very nasty things during that time. I saw the police coming down Hastings Street, smashing guys over the head. That’s on record, of course, lots of people saw that. I saw they was walking down Hastings Street in a very orderly way. I think they were in the way to Stanley Park at that particular time, and the mounted fellows came out there and they broke the whole thing up, the parade, which I think wasn’t necessary. I think it would have been better to have left them alone, because it would bring no harm. They were marching in a very orderly way.

 

Interviewer [00:32:23] Did this affect your thinking at all?

 

Jack McVicar [00:32:26] Yes, very much. It did affect my thinking.

 

Interviewer [00:32:29] In what way?

 

Jack McVicar [00:32:30] Well, it just affected my thinking to the extent that I didn’t think they were getting a good square deal. I think that Canada should have been able to have done something better for unemployed. That doesn’t— Excuse me. [interview paused]

 

Interviewer [00:32:50] How about you, did you just happen to be standing there?

 

Jack McVicar [00:32:55] I was on the top of the BC Electric building at Carroll and Hastings Street and I saw this thing with my own eyes with a few others too.

 

Interviewer [00:33:10] What was the public feeling towards this?

 

Jack McVicar [00:33:14] I think the public were very, very upset at the thing. Those that I contacted and spoke to, they seemed to be very upset. It wasn’t a very nice thing to see. The fellows were trying to conduct themselves properly. I’m speaking of what I saw myself, and I felt very sympathetic towards them. In a country like this where we have so much of everything, it didn’t seem right that they should undergo a condition like that.

 

Interviewer [00:33:54] Well, could you give us the important disputes and strikes, lockouts and wage cut that your local union was involved in?

 

Jack McVicar [00:34:17] Well, that’s a little difficult now. It’s been back so many years, I can’t remember too well about that. I don’t remember really too much about a wage cut, other than the short time, the days we were working. I think the basic wage was left alone.

 

Interviewer [00:34:44] What about strikes?

 

Jack McVicar [00:34:49] You mean were the many strikes?

 

Interviewer [00:34:50] Yeah, well, which were the big strikes, if there were any?

 

Jack McVicar [00:34:53] Well, of course, we had a big strike involving practically all the workers of Canada at one time.

 

Interviewer [00:35:00] Which one?

 

Jack McVicar [00:35:00] That was the time of the, I think, the OBU.

 

Interviewer [00:35:04] 1919.

 

Jack McVicar [00:35:05] 1919, yes.

 

Interviewer [00:35:06] Did your union participate in it?

 

Jack McVicar [00:35:08] Not that I knew of.

 

Interviewer [00:35:09] You don’t know. Tell me, they had a one-day strike. It was either to do with this particular Winnipeg strike, the OBU strike, or else it was the Ginger Goodwin affair, do you remember that?

 

Jack McVicar [00:35:31] I think it was particularly the Winnipeg strike. We had a strike here in sympathy for these chaps, and I think I was very much opposed to that because they had been on strike for some time, previous to this, and I took the attitude it would have been better if we stayed at work and given some moral support to them in a way that we could have given them some financial help. And rather than do that, the strike was pulled and it made us all in the same category that we didn’t have the money to launch out and help the other fellows much. You’ve probably heard of that kind of thing.

 

Interviewer [00:36:12] I think during the Goodwin affair there was a one-day strike on this guy’s funeral in Vancouver.

 

Jack McVicar [00:36:18] Yes, I think there was [unclear].

 

Interviewer [00:36:21] I was wondering, do you remember someone cut off the electricity in the BC Electric, I think, which stopped the streetcars from running. You see, the streetcar men were going to go on, they were supporting the strike. Then they were going get veterans to run, or soldiers to run the streetcars. Well, at that point somebody shut off the electricity, of course, and so they couldn’t run them. Do you remember at all anything?

 

Jack McVicar [00:36:59] That was 1918 you’re referring to. Well, to begin with, it’s illegal to leave a powerhouse or a substation alive without an attendant being there. The company, the BC Electric, were aware that the strike was called. It was up to them to have men in these places to replace the men that were going on strike. I at that time was operating and the chief engineer for the company I was with, he took over from me. But we had instructions from our union that we couldn’t leave the station at say 12 o’clock at night. I think it was 12 o’clock at night that the strike was going to be called for. We couldn’t leave it as a live station, we would have to pull the switches. Now, there may have been cases there at that particular time where these chaps that were going on strike didn’t have the relief and they may have had to pull the switches. In my case, I didn’t have to do that.

 

Interviewer [00:38:10] So you don’t really know who is involved in that at all?

 

Jack McVicar [00:38:16] The power was shut off. Yes, the power was shut off.

 

Interviewer [00:38:23] Because it’s really what made the thing effective, you know, this particular incident, I think.

 

Jack McVicar [00:38:29] Well, the power was shut off because one of our executives of the BC Electric was at the Vancouver Hotel at some dance or a meeting of some kind that night and he was told that there was no lights on, streetcars weren’t running, there was an outage, and he couldn’t leave it because he saw the Burns building on Granville Street lit up, which was supplied by the Western Power Company at that time, which was an opposing company to the BC Electric. And he, afterwards, he went down to Main Street substation and he found they were on strike there.

 

Interviewer [00:39:21] I see. Yeah. What would you consider were the milestones in your life in union and political matters?

 

Jack McVicar [00:39:39] Well, I think the CCF had quite a good effect between labour and management, we’ll put it, like with the other parties, Conservative and Liberal. I think that the CCF had quite good influence in many things that they have done and proposed, and I think labour has benefited by these things.

 

Interviewer [00:40:04] What about the, do you think were the outstanding, if you look back now on your life, what were the outstanding events?

 

Jack McVicar [00:40:13] Well, I would think that one of the very outstanding events is the old age pension, which I think they had sponsored from their very early childhood in these organizations, like the CCF, and many other things that they’ve brought into being, they may not get the credit for it all. I’m not saying—

 

Interviewer [00:40:32] Liberals take all the credit.

 

Jack McVicar [00:40:33] But yes, but the point is they were instrumental in a lot of that legislation we put through and I feel very sorry at times that they weren’t given a little bit more credit, but we know that the credit is given them by us that know more about that part of it.

 

Interviewer [00:40:55] Who would you think,  say were the leaders of your union over the years? Who had the decisive influence?

 

Jack McVicar [00:41:04] Well, we had a very good business manager by the name of Teddy Morrison, who was very, he was, to my way of thinking, a very good man in the position he held. He had a very good head for thinking things out. We didn’t always agree, but I found out as I got to know the man better and I’d argued with him that he really wasn’t wrong. I was the one that was wrong in my thinking. I have to admit that I give him credit for holding the organization of Local 213 together. He did a very, very good job, and I think he was held in high respect by most of the people that knew him.

 

Interviewer [00:41:59] What about the, what has been the influence of the communists’ faction in your union local?

 

Jack McVicar [00:42:09] I don’t think the communists had any great effect in our local. Not to any great extent. It was always more or less a very free-thinking local, conservatism and that kind of thing, and there were the odd people, of course, that expressed themselves very openly, but I think on the whole it was a more or less conservative organization, and right right through the Electrical Workers’ Union, International union, were very conservative. Morrison was a very, very strong labour man, but you couldn’t call Morrison a communist or even a strong socialist. He was just a straight trade union labour man.

 

Interviewer [00:42:58] Well, that’s just done with Morrison. People like Gee, for instance.

 

Jack McVicar [00:43:04] Well now, you bring up Gee. I attended meetings of Local 213, and to be quite honest, I never heard at any time, Gee saying anything that I could take exception to at any of the meetings that I attended. I felt very, very sorry when the thing happened, when Gee was disqualified from his position at the helm. But of course, I didn’t know the whole of the inner workings of that.

 

Interviewer [00:43:45] Well, do you know if anybody or do you have yourself any old historical material?

 

Jack McVicar [00:43:52] Very sorry. I haven’t any of that stuff. You mean photographs and that kind of—I had a very interesting—

 

Interviewer [00:43:57] Papers?

 

Jack McVicar [00:43:58] No. I have a, I had very interesting photograph of the lines being put across the Narrows, the Second Narrows, and I loaned that to the BC Electric company for to have some publication made on their Buzzer, not the Buzzer but their monthly magazine. I never got it back again and it showed the poles there with the men up these very, very high poles, and in fact a lot of our old chaps remember all about that and the names of the chaps that were working on that. But I’m sorry that I don’t have any of that. But I do have a paper, I think I can get that now for you, you can just shut it off.